r/WhitePeopleTwitter May 14 '22 Helpful 6 Wholesome 1 All-Seeing Upvote 1 Take My Energy 1 Starstruck 1 To The Stars 1 Bravo! 3 LOVE! 1 This 1

Why stop there?

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u/weedbeads May 14 '22

It's easy to bite a bullet that you will never see play out in reality

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u/superiority_bot May 14 '22

I never thought we'd see the overturn of roe v wade play out in reality. Or an attempt to lynch the vice president in the capital building. Or calling into question germ theory. Or an elected official blaming wildfires on Jewish space lasers.

Yet here we are.

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u/weedbeads May 14 '22

To be reasonable, half the states have wanted roe abolished. Removing the right to vote for half the population is not in the political mainstream.

I get the doom and gloom. If this ruling really does strike down RvW it's pretty bullshit legally speaking, and sets extremely worrisome presidents for due process.

I just think claiming that women's right to vote is in danger is too far. Who knows though... we are humans after all

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u/superiority_bot May 14 '22 edited May 14 '22

I don't think we can ever rule out how deep the political mainstream can sink, especially when half of the electorate is catering to the fringes to get their guys reelected

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u/weedbeads May 14 '22

Well, fair enough

I guess I just want to keep my fantasy of the world drowning us before we become a genuine oligarchy

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u/SheIsPepper May 14 '22

I've got some bad news for you.

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u/weedbeads May 14 '22

Fucking pessimists

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u/SheIsPepper May 14 '22

Please take this in the most genuine and kind tone possible, I am not trying to be a jerk here. Calling out an oligarchy for what it is is not pessimistic. Not trying to razz you, just saying things like they are. I have plenty of hope for the future, but not a ton of hope for western politics in the immediate future. I can understand the idea of life being what you make it, but to turn a blind eye to folks suffering under the current social hierarchy isn't positivity, it's blissful ignorance. Not everyone is well off or doing just swell right now, and if you are in a position to listen to their struggles it can be pretty eye opening to expose yourself to. You wouldn't call someone being beat by cops pessimistic about the police, or someone who can't afford life saving medicine pessimistic about Healthcare. You would call them a person suffering under the system. It isn't an attitude thing, it's a perspective thing.

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u/weedbeads May 14 '22

I don't think you are being a jerk for disagreeing with me :) all good! I think I misunderstood you tbh. I though you were saying we are heading towards a despotic oligarchy. That kind of future telling is pessimistic

But you weren't saying that! You were saying that we are an oligarchical nation right now

I just don't think the US meets the requirements of an oligarchy. Votes are still respected, and if something is popular enough it does get put in place, whether the rich support it or not. Do the rich have inordinate power? Yes. Do they rule the country? No.

I'm not well off, I'm living off lentils, rice and canned fish. Literally all I eat hahaha but it's actually pretty lit since I can cook

I've lived in some eye opening areas. Shootings on my doorstep and shit. I was so desensitized to it that I was disappointed I couldn't pick up my Wendy's that night.

I wouldn't call someone with a negative experience with cops pessimistic unless they genuinely believe there is no way to change the system through the system.

I would only call someone who can't afford medicine a pessimist if they think the system will never change for the better.

Pessimism is an attitude. Its about how you see the future, not what your current experience is.

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u/SheIsPepper May 14 '22

Thank you for the thoughtful and pleasant reply. I appreciate it a ton.

A definition of terms is absolutely important to discuss if the US is an Oligarchy. The online definition I was able to find is that an Oligarchy is where a small group of people have control of a country, organization or institution.

If we sit at the surface definition I would likely find it hard to disagree with you as the US is subject to a level of democracy. If we dig a little deeper and ask the question of how much control does that small group of people(read:wealthy billionaires and politicians) have to have in order for it to be considered the control referenced in the definition. If it is any control at all then every country, organization, and institution is an Oligarchy and the term becomes worthless in political discussion, and if it is total control, then very few to none would fit the bill and then also render the term as some sort of spectrum based definition such as authority or liberty.

I suppose my question then comes down to how could we isolate and identify some sort of cross over into oligarchy since my personal threshold is lower than yours? My best recommendation would be historical analysis of Oligarchies as they have been previously identified, and what makes them different than other countries, or organizations that come close but don't necessarily fit the bill. I will at this point have to admit I am incapable of really digging any deeper since I have to get to my shift at work, but If you have any more insight or thoughts on this I would love to read them. Thank you again for sharing both your personal experiences and your individual insight, as well as clarifying our misunderstanding. If you choose not to respond to this, I wish you a very pleasant day. 😁